Zezo forum:

Post by chelonia | 2017-11-08 | 09:59:56

Just curious how or where to check the remaining time for auto sails. Last night auto sails was on, only to wake up sailing with a bad sail.

From the virtual robbers website:

"Auto sails are a very convenient tool! Once activated, they allow your boat to sail with the optimal sail regardless of the wind speed or direction.

With the auto sails, you can be sure to sail with the best sail available on your boat.

Auto sails can be activated in X-hour increments (their duration may change for each race). To activate this option, you will have to spend one or more "Auto Sails" cards."

So, ONCE ACTIVATED reads like once it�s activated it�s activated.

To add to the confusion it then goes on saying X-hour increments.

My question is for how many hours, and how/where to check the (remaining) time in order to manage to properly manage the auto sails function.

No reply yet from VR but I will post it here once the frogs respond

20 Comments

Post by HenrikBo | 2017-11-08 | 11:40:01

To my knowledge 12 hours and when you click the auto sail icon it will show remaining time. At least it does on my phone.

Post by chelonia | 2017-11-08 | 11:43:54

Thank you. I suppose it expires without a warning, which is not very well explained in the manual

Fair winds

Post by karriv | 2017-11-08 | 12:00:01

If you hit the Autosails icon, it opens a pane in the top of which there's a counter indicating how long autosails will be active.

Post by chelonia | 2017-11-08 | 12:03:51

Thanks. Like I said, this is not explained at all in the help/manual section of the game/site. They managed to implement a Cash desk bell when a sales completes, but an alarm bell when auto sails expires proofed to be too difficult I guess :-)

Post by hophop | 2017-11-08 | 12:12:55

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cpbbuaIA3Ds

Post by chelonia | 2017-11-08 | 12:36:34

Good stuff!

VR should use this as their theme song

Post by Inicio | 2017-11-08 | 23:43:52

Attention

When the Autosail is activated and you select manually a sail the Autosail is deactivated.

Post by nsp | 2017-11-09 | 00:52:28

Thank you for your information.

I just hope you can reactivate Autosail again after without needing to use a new card.

If not, I must say that legally integrates a concept..and the name of that legal concept is not nice.

Nuno

Post by zezo | 2017-11-09 | 00:55:09

You lose the card, and also suffer a sail change penalty, even if the sail is the same.

There is already a thread on this, 10 topics down

http://zezo.org/forum.pl?tid=6052

Post by nsp | 2017-11-09 | 01:02:31

Is there any place where this is written in VR rules or something like that from VR side?

Post by zezo | 2017-11-09 | 01:09:22

No idea. But that's not the main problem.

The main problem is that is obviously a bug, at least the penalty you suffer, and should be fixed. And then be clearly documented in the change log. Oh, there should be public change log in the first place. And bug tracking system.

There have always been little details like that and those details give quite an advantage to players who are aware of them. I've suffered a lot myself in the past because I never cared to reverse engineer those things, and there are player communities who had.

But even then the bigger problem is that entire idea of "sail change card" is stupid. Forget about the money, but having to thing about one more detail and having one more possibility for error is one more thing too much.

Post by nsp | 2017-11-09 | 01:26:36

No. No. You are not understanding what I mean.

Other than being stupid the use of cards, as we all agree. And a bug. That is urgent to be adressed.

If there are not written instructions and disclaimers accessible to all by the provider of the game and the seller of the cards ...and cards costs credits and credits costs money, this is fraud!!!

As well as a foil sold for credits that costs money taking into account that it doesnt work. It is a fraud!!

Legally!

Nuno

Post by nsp | 2017-11-09 | 01:41:17

CVetan,

I don't want to put things boiling. Just on the opposite.

The term fraud is a concept a legal concept that integrates human behaviours.

I am just being accurate. I don't pretend to insult anyone. I pretend to give a chance to people to correct themselves, but showing them they are wrong. And putting themselves in an idiot risk.

And I can't stay still watching a vendor selling me rotten potatoes and smiling at my face, like he is selling me golden ones.

Time to change policy VR. Time to care about who pays your salaries. Time to don't be greedy and don't mix poker with sailing. Time to be smart. Time to step up and change for good!

cheers

Nuno

Post by zezo | 2017-11-09 | 07:51:28

Have you read the VR TOS/EUA? http://www.virtualregatta.com/CGU_FR.pdf

A lot of stuff in there. Like you don't have the right to cut the potatoes in half to see if they are rotten.

- L�Utilisateur s�engage � ne pas espionner et intercepter les protocoles de communication que la Soci�t� utilise, ni � utiliser un intercepteur pour les donn�es ou le protocole.

I actually bothered to read the last version available in English. Can't find one now. I can see more lines there starting with "user agrees to" than anything else.

Post by zezo | 2017-11-09 | 07:58:10

As they said in the army about the military code of conduct, "it's written in blood". But that's probably true about any proper contract/EULA.

Post by mcmgj | 2017-11-09 | 10:05:02

AUTO SAIL is not always good, indeed auto can change 2 times of sail in 5 minutes to return to the initial sail when one is close to the efficiency of another sail, only, you "benefit" from 2 penalties not compensated by the change of sail, it is better to sail 10 minutes with a bad sail than to change 2 times, if the difference is not significant.

Post by Patrice | 2017-11-09 | 10:24:19

Exact mcmgj...AUTO SAIL ne fonctionne pas correctement et p�nalise beaucoup plus que si on s'occupe nous m�me de nos voiles!!! cette option payante est une arnaque!!!...ou alors le concepteur du jeu n'y comprend rien � la voile!!!

Post by nsp | 2017-11-09 | 18:12:28

Hi Cvetan,

I have just read the VR TOS/EUA.

Two things:

Keeping it in simple language
In face of the EU law and even the French law I have founded doubts regarding all those rules in favor of one part without any bennefits for the other. I mean, a contract have to have balance, if not it can be seen as something that can be declared canceled or declared null by a court of law.

This in general. I don't intend to be thourogh on this situation and certainly don't want to feed even more any fire throwing gasoline on it.

Second, in this moment, VR is on default with almost all the second part of article 2 with their clients. That is clear and a fact. And I wouldn't go any further, because if I go, it would be bad.

But more than that. I find it difficult to accept that someone pretends that a game/service that it is not ready, and has so much problems and things not working despite they say: "buy it because you go faster" (ex: foils on port, or the cancelation of autosails by just testing a sail manually) can be the subject of those rules. If it doesn't work and you pay for it and they don't fix it they are on default or if it's proven they never wanted to do it..its fraud..i hope it's not he case.

In my opinion, in this moment, we all are testers, we are testing and comunicating....(strange fact: in a different forum, because VR is on default and doesn't provide on VR site the forum that they compromised to create also in article 2)..but i was saying, we are comunicating and informing about problems and bugs, because when we contact them the only thing that we get is an automatic email answer saying that technical services are going to contact us. And for that...well i don't mind to pay to amuse myself, but at least i would like to have a "thank you" and a "I am sorry" after all we are being the laboratory mouses of VR.

So regarding, the rules, i am going to forget they exist. For me common sense is far better than what i saw written there. That is a pile of crappy words that unfortunatelly tells me a lot...

Fair winds to all

Nuno

Post by chelonia | 2017-11-09 | 18:47:01

Consideration - Quid Pro Quo

Consideration in English law is one of the four main building blocks of a contract. Consideration can be anything of value (such as an item or service), which each party to a legally binding contract must agree to exchange if the contract is to be valid. If only one party offers consideration, the agreement is not legally a binding contract. In its traditional form, expressed as the requirement that in order for parties to be able to enforce a promise, they must have given something for it (quid pro quo): something must be given or promised in exchange or return for the promise. A contract must be "met with" or "supported by" consideration to be enforceable; also, only a person who has provided consideration can enforce a contract. In other words, if an arrangement consists of a promise which is not supported by consideration, then the arrangement is not a legally enforceable contract. Mutual promises constitute consideration for each other. ("I promise you that I will do X, in consideration for which you promise me that you will do Y").

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consideration_in_English_law

Post by nsp | 2017-11-09 | 20:05:00

I didn't want to be so technical but yes.

That's why there are legal limitations to abusive general clauses in contracts. Because in fact there is no real negotiation.

Tipically insurance contract clauses, eu's; etc. and this kind of rules or contracts have legal limitations in order to protect the consumer to avoid abuse by the strongest part - the seller, provider of the service, etc.

EU has been very strict on this matters. Normally consumers are not aware.

That was what i was referring in my post.

Consideration is part of it...it's the balance in the contract.

If there isn't balance, if there is default, something is going wrong, and the validity of the contract is at risk.

But I stop here this is sailing, this is playing, not law ...:)

Noone of you care about this :))) we just want VR to give us what they promised us..And they are not doing it.

Nuno